i have a thought for my friends that read this blog to ponder. i was listening to a christian radio station program a week or so ago and a man was talking about how he and his wife do not believe in birth control. i heard him say, "we trust God in everything else why not this area". Brian and i were talking about this and his comment was, "then why can a woman be able to get pregnant at certain times of the month. God made our bodies. He orchestrated that aspect of a woman's body." so i was like yeah you're right. if our bodies hadn't been created w/ this "ability to know when" then we could get pg ALL THE TIME know matter what. i'm not on the pill right now just b/c i'm too lazy to go to my doctor and ask for it. we use the calender method. i wasn't on the pill when i got pg w/ Mattie but soon after she was born i got on it. i have no problems w/ "the pill" as long as it isn't the kind that cause abortions obviously.
just wondering what you think about that man's comment. interesting i must say.
Friday, March 28, 2008
a can of worms
Posted by Steph at 9:07 AM
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13 comments:
Just replying to your comment.
I'd love to work out at home, but I just don't have the equipment.
Plus, I love to drive. The only difficult part is keeping the kids from driving me crazy.
At the YMCA, they have Child Watch--like a nursery. All the kids can stay for 2 hours at a time, and I get to workout, shower, read my Bible. It's great. And, I feel so refreshed afterward, I want to go everyday.
I was actually thinking of skipping today, but my own comment here makes me want to go!
you can just email me if you want, leahjones5702@sbcglobal.net, so we don't have to keep leaving our replies on each others blogs.
I would go 2x a day, but the trip is really long, especially for the baby.
Okay...I believe the problem comes in when we leave God out of the planning of our family, by taking steps to make *certain* that we will not have more children. The calendar, I don't have a problem with....the calendar has been my friend ;) I believe that is "natural", and still leaves room for God's will. Surgical intervention is never an option in my mind. That would be like telling God I know better than Him. Regarding the pill, I HIGHLY recommend the book "Does the Birth Control Pill Cause Abortions" by Randy Alcorn. You can buy one for $3 at http://www.epm.org/bcp.html , or I could look for my copy and mail it to you if you would like.
Even abstinence is birth control.
We have used the Natural Family Planning Method that the Catholic Church teaches.
We began using it after #2 (Elijah) was born.
Since I never get my cycle back until the babies are almost 2 years of age (still breastfeeding), NFP has served us well. By the time the baby is 18 months, we begin to get that "it'd be okay if we had another one now" feeling.
No birth control at all, I think, is irresponsible. Like I said, 'Even abstinence is birth control.'
One can get pregnant even without a "cycle"...that's how my sister-in-law got her second and my Aunt got her second, thinking "I haven't had a period!"
As for the comment..I think God is there for everyone in any choices they make, when they've gone to him and some who might be close to believing if they only took the time to see his hand in their lives. Some couples don't mind having 8 or more children. Jamie and I wouldn't still be a couple after say like number 4 because we just couldn't handle it well. I used "clomid" so even the calendar method wouldn't of worked for me either to HAVE a child or to NOT have a child so guess what, I'm getting my tubes tied. My body is not regular and I've known many women who couldn't rely on the calendar method, espcecially the ones who only cylce like every three to 6 months! I do not feel I'm playing God. I struggled with that. I want to have a healthy marriage, a close family and a the strength to serve anyone and everyone = something I know I couldn't do if I physically have more children (this pregnancy is just very hard on me in many different ways). I'm for adoption, there are too many children out there that their "parents" didn't trust in God enough to know 1. they were worth more than a one night stand or sex without commitment and 2. that the best chance for a child is to be born in a complete family unit. O, boy this could get deep - I'd better go to sleep.
FYI, and hoping to cause no offense, but NFP is not the calendar method. There is a lot of charting and watching the 'signs' out womanly bodies give us to determine fertility--whether you want to avoid pregnancy or increase your chances of pregnancy.
Also, I have never had a return of fertility--watching all the signs and symptoms of fertility with NFP (Natural Family Planning) has always warned me of pending fertility even before I got my cycle back, so I've always known if I could get pregnant, even without a period.
Third, I don't ever judge anyone on their decision to control their fertility or not. Some couples control it by taking drugs to increase the chances of fertility, some use drugs to stop fertility.
I understand both, though I don't believe either are for me. Ending fertility with a surgical procedure is a hard decision, and should only come after a lot of prayer. For some women, two children is their limit. I can certainly respect that. For others, choosing not to interfere at all is a great choice.
I have always breastfed my babies, and fertility has never returned before 18 months after the second child. The first child was premature, so breastfeeding got of to a poor start, but we eventually succeeded!
Bless you, Steph, as you and Brian sort out this decision. Remember to pray and read. Seek Him first, his is the only opinion that matters.
Love you guys!
Here is what we believe, and probably many won't agree, but here it is. We believe God gives us the passions and desires for what His will is for our lives. We also agree with the main truth that we should trust God with EVERY aspect of our lives, that He is to be sought for every decision. We don't always accomplish thinking of what He wants before we make decisions, but that is our goal and what we know He desires of us. We also believe God makes the way for those things to happen that He asks of us.
So, what does that mean for birth control for us? Well, we use it when we don't have the desire or dream for more children. I don't disagree with the belief that trusting God with our family members means not using birth control. I just don't agree that if you are using it, you aren't trusting God with it. So, for example, we just had a baby six weeks ago. We don't have the desire for more in our near future to be sure. So, we will use something to protect from having more children. With our last effort and success to get pregnant, we both just really felt God telling us He had another person in mind to add to our family. At that point we stopped using birth control, and God gave us our desire. We don't feel guilty for using it in the past, and we are going to use it again until God gives us the desire to do differently.
The title of your post is correct. This is a can of worms. I have strong opinions on the subject, but I don't want to discuss them in your comments.
Ahh, I love this can of worms. I think you basically know how I feel. But...
Basically I just feel like this is one of those issues that isn't black and white. For me, it is sort of like the Santa Claus/Easter Bunny thing (although quite a bit more substantial in its content of course...I mean, we're talking about human beings here, not rabbits...but...). Some think of the Santa Claus/Easter Bunny as a definite black/white, this-is-not-biblical thing. They have very strong opinions and think that it is wrong for everyone, not just them. Some see it as wrong for them, but can understand if others do it. Some see it as crazy that others would not want to do it and "what's wrong with them anyway? Extremists! Radicals!!" :)
Personally, I just see this as another not-so-black-and-white issue. I think that God can speak to each one personally and He might tell you (i.e. sometimes that is in the form of just the desires He gives you, sometimes He speaks in other ways) how many He wants you to have, when to have them, etc.
I think we can all agree that God can speak to us personally. I think we can all also agree that "Like arrows in the hands of a warrior are sons born in one's youth. Blessed is the man whose quiver is full of them. They will not be put to shame when they contend with their enemies in the gate." God says that it's good to have a quiver full of them, but He also doesn't give a specific number. So, these are the real questions we are left with...
Can we be given that information by God as to how many arrows he wants in our own specific family...and can we then use man-made prevention after we've reached that number, or to space out our children that He is giving us?
Or, does He not tell us how many He wants in our specific families and we are just supposed to let Him give us however many He wants to give us over the years of childbearing time, which of course implies that He will also give us the desire for the amount He gives us in the timing He gives them to us.
And, along the same lines, what man-made (or man-watched) prevention is acceptable and what isn't? Can you only use the temp. checks and charts and vag. discharge signs and symptoms or can you use a pill? (although NFP is definitely ideal in that it's just so natural, if you do feel that God is giving you the "stop sign" forever or for a while, this just doesn't always work for everyone as a form of birth control; I'll give examples if you wish, but otherwise won't get into it)
I think I've arrived at the answer to this for me personally. But, in my opinion, each person has to come to this conclusion in their own lives concerning these questions and to a decision in their own lives about their own personal fertility. It won't be the same for everyone, but that's just my opinion.
I hate worms, first of all.
Levi and I have clearly been spoken to that we are not to make any more children together. I switch back and forth when I see a non-crying baby, hold a non-crying baby, or hear a non-crying baby and I get "baby fever" but, heck, my dad has baby fever right now. It's just one of those things.
We have however, been clearly spoken to that we are to leave room in our "quiver" for future adopted children, fostered children, or even a second home away from home for college students. We don't exactly know what that means but we know God wants us to leave room for children not from my hoo-ha.
So we have chosen a form of birth control that suits us best and we are very happy with it.
I really have no concern whatsoever what any other Christian who has searched out God's will does. That's their business and I got too much of my own business to care.
That's all I got. Burn me at the stake......
p.s. If for some reason I turn up pregnant...we trust that God knows what he's doing :)
The financial aspect of all this is certainly one to consider. Honestly though none of the "large" families (how does it take to be considered a "large" family, anyway?) I know live in poverty. I certainly am not saying there are NOT large families that are very poor, and rely on government assistance. I think in general if you are living by Godly principles, though, you will find your needs met without government assistance. Of course, NEEDS is the operative word here. Having "only" 6 myself, I am thinking of a family that I know who have 12 children. The only government assistance they receive is medical. The dad works two jobs, and the mom is very frugal and creative with their finances. The older children gladly work to help pay for their own extras such as camp, etc. The contrast between those children and an "only" child I know, whose parents intentionally had an "only" for her financial and material benefit, is indescribable. I compare those two families, and the one with the greater amount of financial resources does not seem the "richer" to me.
The idea of having more chidren as a matter of pride or seeking glory seems funny to me, as where we live you are basically considered a freak if you have more than 3 children. Sometimes, sadly, even in the church. Why, you might not be able to send them on every trip they want to go on, or buy them each a pair of the new "in" $200 pair of shoes. Heaven forbid! LOL, but seriously, I am sure there are circles where that "holier than thou" attitude may exist, but I personally haven't seen it.
That being said, although I have strong opinions on the subject, there are definately "gray" areas, biblically speaking, on this. The matter of submitting to your husband, however, is clearly spoken to and I can completely respect that.
Hoping you'll forgive me for addressing rhetorical questions-
Liana
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